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Touchdown Jaguars!
Touchdown Jaguars!
Episode 127: Rams/Jaguars Week 7 Analysis – Wembley Woes: Jaguars Grounded in London
We break down a 35–7 loss to the Rams that turned optimism into hard questions about quarterback play, receiver reliability, penalties, protection, and coaching choices. The bye week becomes a reset: retool the call sheet, reassess the WR room, and get healthier on defense.
The specific topics discussed this week included the following:
• Why the offense stalled in London
• Trevor Lawrence’s inconsistency vs. context of drops and hits
• Brian Thomas Jr.’s traffic-catch struggles and fit
• Travis Hunter’s career day
• Run game underuse with Travis Etienne and Co.
• Defensive impact of Travon Walker and missing Devin Lloyd
• Strength of schedule outlook and wild card math
• Realistic trade targets and roster triage
Make sure you click the Linktree link in the show notes of this and every single episode to find everything you need, Touchdown Jaguars related. Use promo code Touchdown Jaguars on SeatGeek to save $20 off your first purchase.
James Johnson and Phil Barrera bring you the best and most up to date Jacksonville Jaguars news. "Touchdown Jaguars!" is a tribute to the prospective ownership group "Touchdown Jacksonville!" In 1991, the NFL announced plans to add two expansion teams and "Touchdown Jacksonville!" announced its bid for a team, and Jacksonville was ultimately chosen as one of five finalists. In November 1993, the NFL owners voted 26–2 in favor of awarding the 30th franchise to Jacksonville. James and Phil have been fans of the franchise ever since and have had the honor (and sometimes dishonor) of covering the team professionally since 2017. The rest as they say, is history.
Welcome to the Touchdown Jaguars Podcast. Here are your hosts, James Johnson and Phil Smith.
SPEAKER_02:Hey everyone, welcome back to the Touchdown Jaguars Podcast. I'm your co-host, Phil Barrera, and joining me as always is your other co-host, James Johnson. And uh Jay, we are recording here on a Sunday evening, of course, because the Jacksonville Jaguars played very early this morning over in London. I mean, it uh the box score says that they played. I don't know if anybody actually showed up. Uh Los Angeles showed up yesterday and played pretty well. You know, I thought they were supposed to be tired. They didn't play like a tired football team, Jay. One of us, uh one of the teams was actually looked actually very sleepy and very doubt of it. And the other one was pre uh and the other one was prepared to play football today. So we're gonna unpack all of that here this evening, Jay. But uh, you know, as always, good to be here with you as we record a new episode. But unfortunately, uh what we were hoping to avoid did not happen as the Jaguars have now uh have now had back-to-back losses heading into their bye. But uh other than that, how are you doing here tonight, man?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, man, as I told you in the the pre-pod speech, I was heated at first. Um, but then I I had to give myself a dose of my own medicine, right? Of um what I say about the players where you can't get too high, can't get too low with the Jacksonville Jaguars. So uh once I came to that, um I cooled down a little bit, still a little bit heated, but we'll talk about that and the issues we saw. But um, yeah, man, it was it was tough to watch. Is um, you know, I think it could be one of the things, um, and we'll talk about a bunch of issues that occurred too, but it just dawned on me. One thing it could have probably been too is that I didn't really think about it until now. Is maybe it was just the teacher knowing the student so well, and and Sean McVay um knowing, you know, what he's going against and Liam Cohen so well, and also having you know more years invested into their rebuild as opposed to Liam. Um, that just dawned on me too, as well. So, yeah, man, it was a case where it just seemed like we couldn't do much right at all, man, from offense. Um, the defense had some moments in the third quarter, but um still ultimately a defensive performance where you still have a lot of questions, right? And uh a lot of things you wouldn't want to see on their end, especially in the first and second quarters, um, third quarter, uh excuse me, fourth quarter as well. So, you know, they're not uh completely unblamable in this one, and we'll talk about all of that today. In episode with 127, 128 feel. I lost track. That's what two losses will do to you, man.
SPEAKER_02:I know, I know, just out of it. Yeah, 127.
SPEAKER_00:Right, right. But um, yeah, man, we'll get into it here, man. And um, yeah, man, hopefully we give the people um the episode that they are looking for coming off of this loss.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, you kind of like got a sense early too that it was just man, this is not gonna be their day, even when they were down only 14, and then of course they you know that lead continued to inflate. I mean, they've come back uh from 14 points a couple of times this season, but you just got the sense that that was not going to happen today, and it did not, and it only got worse from there. So uh we'll unpack all of that here this evening and also kind of discuss like what we think they need to address heading into the buy. Uh, you know, there's a lot of uh rumors and expectation there that maybe in a couple weeks when they head to Vegas, you know, we're gonna have some new guys on the team. So we'll talk about all that here tonight. Um, wanna first mention uh and shout out those of you who have been supporting the podcast and welcome in, brand new listeners. Make sure you click the Linktree link in the show notes of this and every single episode to find everything you need, touchdown Jaguars related. You can find all of our social media sites as well as our promo code Touchdown Jaguars that you can use over on SeatGeek to save$20 off of your first purchase. And uh we appreciate those of you that have done so already. But uh yeah, Jay, uh as we have uh as we know by now, the Jacksonville Jaguars fell to the Los Angeles Rams 35 to 7 in their annual trip to London. Uh, we had the pleasure of joining a podcast during the week called East Coast Rams. Uh shout out to them, really, really awesome host, and we had a really great time uh hanging out with them over there. And you know, we kind of talked about a lot of I would say, you know, just positive stuff in cur in terms of like the direction of the team. And man, as as far as the performance goes, like this is this is the exact performance that makes you think, well, what were we like talking about when it came to that optimism? Because they really did their best to strip all that optimism away from the fan base. It wasn't a good day for Trevor Lawrence, it wasn't a good day for the offense, and as you alluded to, like the defense was kind of starting to like the defense gave them opportunities in the third quarter, and the offense just could not do anything. Um, Cam Little having another bad day. They've uh you know, I I don't expect him to be the kicker in two weeks. We can discuss that, but uh it's just a an overall, a day where really nothing went right. So, Jay, I'll let you kind of start wherever you want. Well, actually, no, we have to start with what everybody is debating online and what a lot of people are talking about and discussing. And it's Trevor Lawrence, 23 of 48, 296 yards, and a touchdown. And Trevor Lawrence has always been, of course, a topic of a major topic of conversation amongst the national media. And we have always, you know, a lot of people have defended their guy, our our guy, and you know, you you talk about you know, drops and the lack of protection, especially in the last few weeks. I'll bring up a stat from Daniel Griffiths a little bit later. But where are we at right now on Trevor Lawrence? I brought this up a couple of weeks ago after a poor performance against San Francisco, uh, or not the best performance, I should say. Uh, you know, it seemed like he had kind of turned this corner in terms of trying to or getting to learn this offense. And uh, they're just these miscues, and and they weren't necessarily as many mental miscues as they were physical miscues for him just being a quarterback and being the guy that we expected him to be. I'm not going to sit here and say we need to go get a quarterback, bring in Jameis Wimston, bring in Kirk Cousins. Like, these are things we joke about, like in our group chat, but like these aren't things I actually want to see happen. What I will say is I am at a point where it's like heading into the offseason, especially if these things continue 10 weeks from now, you know, 10 more games left. Like, yeah, that 10 more games left in the season, and he's not making significant strides. I'm talking like if we're not in the position to get into the playoffs because of him, the wild card, then I'm I'm saying, hey, James Glips Gladstone, figure this out money-wise, and we just kind of go from there. That's where I'm at with Trevor Lawrence, right? The Trevor Lawrence experiment obviously has not gone the way that we want it to, and a lot of people are frustrated, a lot of people are still on both sides. So, where are you right now? Again, a day remove, you know, we've had essentially the entire day to decompress and think about his performance. So let's start with Trevor Lawrence. Let's start with 16.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I'm on the first start by saying, you know, people can feel, you know, how they want to feel. Um, but one thing I will say for the the people who defend Trevor Lawrence to the T, it's okay to say the man had a bad game and did not look well. You know what I'm saying? Like, and I'm here to say that he did not look good at all today, right? Uh, there were missed throws, um, some miscues he tried to spin move again, Phil, by the way, that fell massively. Um, and yeah, I and I'm at a place where I could just like honestly, um, if you had to like rank the top issues in this game where I could, you know, make a strong case for him being number one at a top of the list, right? And the consistency, man, is just frustrating, which I put in our thread, by the way, as well. That's what's frustrating about him because we were just talking about like he was looking pretty respectable these last two games. And then he he goes out there and um you know he has the game that he has. Now, one thing that we talked about though in the post or the pre-pod discussion is the problem with Trevor Lawrence and ranking him, regardless if you want to rank him atop the list as the issues for this game or the whole season in general. The problem with that is a close number second, if it's not the top on your list, is gonna be drops, right? And regardless of if you want to move on from Trevor Lawrence or you've got a quarterback in mind in the draft of free agency, well, essentially that quarterback that you put in Trevor Lawrence's shoes is gonna have the same issues, which is drops as well. So my argument has always been why not see if we can fix those issues with Trevor and see how he performs, which you know, people can make cases on both sides of the fence. He'll look decent, he'll look good, he'll look okay, he'll look bad, whatever the case may be. You can make cases uh on both sides of the fence. I tend to think he will look better minus the drops, because what that would do is it would put him in a position where and we see this a lot with him too, with his his flaws, right? Where he'll he'll miss somebody wide open that he shouldn't miss, and then he'll turn around on third down and make this crazy throw on third down and convert it, right? Well, you can't convert on third down when you have the drop rate that the Jaguars are having, right? It's just it's fighting an uphill battle, right? It's just like crawling out of the hole and then slipping in mud and falling back into it, right? Or or if not a drop that stops them from converting on third down, it's a it's a penalty. We ain't even talk about that part, Phil. 13 penalties again today. So again, going back to what I was saying, if you want to replace Trevor Lawrence, okay. We'll use Kirk Cousins as an example. Let's bring him into the mix here. Well, let me see Kirk Cousins overtake 13 penalties. Let me see Kirk Cousins or whatever rookie quarterback you want to get overcome the drops that we had. By the way, the Jaguars have led the leg and league in drops the last two years. Let me see him overcome that too. So basically, you're just placing another set of issues because these issues are so close in proximity to Trevor Lawrence, you're placing those issues on another quarterback. Okay. So when you have that discussion, just know you also have to have the discussion of going into a what we would call a rebuild because that puts you in another position where a lot of these things, and me and Phil talked about this before, a lot of these things that James Gladstone and Liam Cohen came here for because they thought it would be a quick renovation, and they had a lot of the premium positions fixed, they thought, which was Brian Thomas Jr., Trevor Lawrence, Josh Allen, Trayvon Walker. A lot of those things for whatever reasons aren't showing up right now. So that being said, you're gonna put yourself if you want to replace Trevor Lawrence. Well, you also need to have the conversation about getting the right receivers here. Who, you know, we we don't know if we have a number one receiver, which we'll talk about Travis Hunter a little bit today, too, Phil. He had a great performance, so that's good news. That's good news. But you don't know that he'll be the number one receiver yet because you look on the defensive side, they need him there equally there too. So that's another conversation to have. Um, but whatever quarterback you bring in, just know it's not as simple as just fixing Trevor Lawrence. You gotta fix the technical issues, which is the penalties and the drops. You got to fix the offensive line as well, too, because the essentially those problems are gonna fall on the next quarterback, too. And then we'll be talking about him just like we're talking about Trevor Lawrence, too, and shipping them out of here as well.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it is obviously the most it's the easiest thing to criticize because obviously the you know the quarterback is front and center, and also you know, a couple of years ago, you know, five years ago, we thought, oh my god, like we finally got the guy. Like we had always we had never found ourselves in the position to get Andrew Luck, to get Peyton Manning, to get that guy, to get whatever that next anointed quarterback was going to be, and all of a sudden, you know, uh, you know, Fran Frank Gore uh runs into the end zone and helps the Jaguars secure the number one overall pick. And because we have been a franchise that has just been looking for that guy for so long, right? Since since Brunel left, and we've tried so many different pieces, and you know, this we know we they've given him the money, you know, pr granted it's the previous regime, but um yeah, just things we're not supposed to be seeing in year five from a guy that you're paying this much money to. I'm sure Dolphins fans feel very similar, right? Like it's you know, the the difference is the Jaguars are four and three, the Miami Dolphins are out of it, you know. So it's it's it's an interesting feel it's an interesting feeling because we're not they're four and three heading into the bye, and we would have taken that back in August. The thing is, like, also is at us at a certain point as a franchise, like you gotta get out of that mindset, right? Like you want to be five and two. You you should expect to be five and two or something like that at this point. Like, you shouldn't be getting blown out in on a consistent basis, like two weeks in a row. You know, that shouldn't be happening. So it's a straight, you know, we've we've been covering this team a long time, and they're and uh but this is like one of the strangest feelings I've had for this team because it's like man, weeks one through four, one through five, what a what a ride, right? And now here we are again with this familiar feeling, and it's like, what the hell do we do now, man?
SPEAKER_00:You know, and another thing I want to bring up too, Phil though, too, is um, I think, and I'm guilty of it too, right? Um, I'm you know, I I don't mind admitting like where I was right and wrong and stuff, but I'm guilty of this too. But a lot of us like we feel like being that he was drafted number one overall, right? That he's supposed to be this Andrew Luck, Peyton Manning like talent, right? And this is another thing that kind of links with the conversation I had as to you know the questions that need to be asked when you say you want to move on from Trevor Lawrence too. When you look at some of the last Super Bowls, too, history is now starting to show a little bit that you don't have to have like this elite uh tier one quarterback to get to the Super Bowl, right? You look at people like looking at the last two Super Bowls, right? Um Jalen Hurts is not to me, he's not elite. You know what I'm saying? Like people could make the argument that he could, and some people can make a valid argument, but not to me, he's not elite. Brock Purdy was in the Super Bowl before that. Granted, he didn't win it, but he was in the Super Bowl before that, right? So like I think that's another thing, too, we gotta get out of our heads, too, is like, yeah, we should expect you know, we we should come into this thinking, ex having the expectations that the fans had when the Patriots were going through their dynasty, sure, in terms of record-wise. But in terms of the quarterback, we we don't have to expect Trevor Lawrence to be like this elite quarterback, too, which that can that actually could frustrate you a little bit more, too, when you look at it from that perspective, too. It's because, well, he's not even looking like the tier two quarterbacks at times, but if he can get in that like tier two or like a tier or two above where he's playing, um, you know, they could certainly get by. Now, granted, that that also will take a good defense on the other side of the field, which we have seen shades of too, by the way. We've seen shades that we can have these defenses that can propel these players that I just mentioned, Brock Purdy and Jalen Hurts, into the Super Bowl, right? So, you know, I I just wanted to get that out of the way in terms of he doesn't have to be a number one pick type of player in terms of his play.
SPEAKER_02:Right. I I think the yeah, and you know, it's it's not totally his fault, but it you know, when he's he is saddled with those expectations, you know. So the I think the difference is like when you talk about like a Brock Purdy and a and a Philadelphia, so yeah, you don't need you don't need the quarterback to be playing at an elite level, but you do need a certain part of the ball, like someone on your team playing at the elite level, right? For last year for Philly, it was Saquon Barkley and their defense, you know, and like right now, early on it looked like it would have been, you know, it's our defense and Travis Etienne, you know what I mean? And and that has kind of like disappeared here at this point. And injuries are part of that, but you know, good teams win, good teams figure it out. And right now they're going in the wrong direction. So um, yeah, but what are the things do you want to point out? I mean, if you want, actually, I think this is the a good time to get into Brian Thomas Jr. Uh I I because you had some really, really strong thoughts about that. I did want to bring up the statistic here that I alluded to that from Daniel Griffiths um today here against the Rams, four drops, 13 penalties, uh, seven sacks allowed, and 11 QB hits. So uh to your point, is Kirk Cousins spinning out of those sacks? Is um uh you know, Jameis Winston doing that? No. The only guy that's probably going to do that, and I know it's a pipe dream for a lot of people, Lamar Jackson maybe has a better day today. Uh he ain't Lamar Jacksonville is not happening as much as I would love it. I would love for the Ravens to make that mistake. It's it's that that Madden trade is not happening, not even in Madden, actually. That's not happening. But um, yeah, Jay, I mean, I didn't watch the press conference fully, but I I do I did read that like you can clearly hear the frustration uh from from Liam Cohen, Liam Cohen when it comes to Brian Thomas Jr. And obviously the fans have just basically had it at this point too. So um, yeah, what are your thoughts on Brian Thomas Jr.? Because it seems like we have hit a wall with him, which is a bummer after a stellar rookie season, but I don't really know what can be done at this point. It feels like, and what you're what you had talked about is like this is what it is at this point with him.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, and I actually made this discovery earlier in the year, and it it's crazy because now I'm seeing the tweets about it. Like I even saw a tweet about um Brian Thomas and his rate of catching the ball in the middle of the field. And earlier the conversation that I was having earlier this year, like two or three or four episodes ago, whenever it was, um, was the fact that Brian Thomas, the reason he was successful a lot of last year is because when you turn on like the tape of Brian Thomas last year, a lot of the catches he had to make were either catches where he was way downfield with just a safety or a cornerback on him where you know getting hit's not a big issue, right? And if you get hit, it's not gonna be hard. Or it was a position where he would catch something like, I don't know, let's say just like a I'm off the top of my head, a crosser where nobody was in his vicinity and he can get yardage after the catch. But what we're seeing is in this offense, it requires you to catch the ball and and go in the middle of the field and you know, sometimes um protect yourself or brace yourself for a hit or so on and so forth. And that's just like we're coming to the reality that that's just not his game, you know. And I've always highlighted it's always been a thing with me. Like even when he was successful, I've always highlighted the drops. I hate to keep coming back to it, but it's in my scouting report. And it's in our text thread where I said, you know, what scared me the most about him as a prospect was the drops, and here we are, you know, he's enduring the drops and it's hurting us in a big way. Now, again, as I said many, many episodes ago, um, if he is going through something mentally, um then I I I definitely can feel for him, okay. If if that is the case, and at the end of the day, I I do want to highlight that these are actual people too, right? Like I know they get paid a lot of money, but they're actual people. I know they're professionals and you expect them to do their job, but there's a human element to it too. So if that's the case, then you know I I definitely um feel for the young man, right? And I don't want to like throw dirt on him while he's going through something that he could be going through along those lines if it's mental health related, right? Um, but that being said, just bringing it back home, going back to what I was saying before. Um, yeah, just the ability to catch the ball in the middle of defenses. And it was one, I think it was him or Diomi. It was one pass where he had to catch the ball, where you can clearly see, you know, anybody who understands receiver mechanics could see it right off the rip. Where he's thinking about getting hit before he catches the ball, he catches the ball, drops it, tries to move the defender or or basically push the defender off of him and protect himself and try and go back to catch the ball, kind of like thing, right? And that that's an indication that mentally, in terms of catching the ball in traffic and bracing for impact, is really affecting his psyche. And you you can't play, especially in this offense, but the game of football, you can't play it like that. You just simply can't. And as Phil said and I have said, like, it don't matter if you want to get Trevor Lawrence out of the picture. Kirk Cousins or whoever you want to get off the street or whatever your favorite college quarterback prospect is, he can't fix that, right? That's also something that Liam Cohen can't fix. That's something your wide receiver coach can't fix. That's something you as a player, as a receiver, have to fix internally. So now we're at a position where like it definitely you got to put wide receiver atop the list of needs, right? And I would go as far as saying if seeing if you can trade the man, you know. Um, and again, if his mental health related, you know, I do hope he gets the help he needs in that regard. But um I I would like to see him traded um because I don't think we're gonna get not at least in this offense, the Brian Thomas that we saw last year. And uh, you know, we might need to start looking at Travis Hunter as the number one receiver. I know last week, and we'll talk about this field. I know last week we're talking about seeing him more at cornerback. Um, but now the list keeps growing of needs, right? And we may need Travis Hunter to do a little bit more. Um, but I don't think Brian Thomas Jr. is the answer. And uh also what doesn't help me believe he's the answer is when since when has a Trent Balkey receiver that is drafted high in the draft been successful? That kind of did it for me when I thought about it from that perspective. It's like, yeah, like Trent's never had a great track record of hitting on that position high in the draft. Yeah, we got Parker Washington in like the fifth round or something like that. But I'm talking about high draft pick investments into the that it's just something he can't evaluate. And I think it was a poorly evaluated just looking at it in hindsight now. It's easy to say that now because he's having the season he's having, but I look, I feel like that was a um poor evaluation on the scouting team last year.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, man. It is it's definitely gonna go down as like if this continues, and you know, there's there's a lot of football left, like that's a cliche thing to say, but like and it seemed like he had been kind of getting right over the last couple of weeks, and but if this trend continues, like if this is just who he is, and you know, last year was uh just kind of a um you know, kind of a wash. Uh it's gonna be one of the most I think it will definitely go down as one of the like most depressing picks ever because of how it started. And like you said, like this is definitely one of those pieces that would have been alluring for a Liam Cohen for a James Gladstone, and now they have to go back to the drawing. I tweeted during the game, like this list of things they need to fix over the course of the bye week, that list is getting longer and longer. Like, if the list is just interior defensive linemen and maybe a second wide receiver, cool. But now it's tight end, it's interior defensive lineman, it's probably safety, right? It is um uh what what was the other um oh uh another receiver, you know what I mean? Like Chris Olave's name is being thrown out there. All these guys, Jacoby Myers, like now that list goes from two things to five or six kicker. Damn kicker now. So that list goes from a couple things to now five or six, and those are just not fixable in a bye week. It's just not, you know.
SPEAKER_00:So yeah, if this goes fixable in a with next year's draft, like it's right, no, six positions in one draft.
SPEAKER_02:No, you're gonna. I mean, it can you could you hit on that? Sure, but you know, we're not the Eagles, you know, we're not we're the Philadelphia Eagles. That's you know, that's just not going to happen. So yeah, man. Like you said, if he's going through something, then of course we're sending out uh sending out everything uh you know all the positive thoughts in the world to him. But it at this point, you know, well from what we saw, you know, Travis Hunter is our number one. He's wide receiver one, and they need to, you know, and then I guess you just kind of figure it out in the secondary at this point. But Travis Hunter showed why he is he was deserving of that draft compensation. And if he needs to move to the to be the more focal point, then so be it. And maybe Brian Thomas is just a really good number two, that'd be great. If he's just a really good number two wide receiver, I'll take that at this point, you know, especially with like you said, Tram Balgi's track record and wide receivers. But yeah, if you do want to transition to a more positive thing, if you want to talk about Travis Hunter, I will take it.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah, sure, man. Why not? Um, I feel like I'm I'm normally the one that brings some positivity into it, but um, you got to balance it out, right? I can't be positive all the time, but yeah, that let's let's talk about Travis Hunter, right? Um, I think what was impressive about him is um we didn't see him enough on defense, and um, it probably was because they had him on offense most of the time, and this this kind of goes back to the WIG thing you mentioned, right? Is if they game plan throughout the week where he spends a majority of his time in the offensive room with the wide receivers and whatnot, um, you know, it's kind of hard to um get him up to speed in terms of where you can incorporate them more on the defensive side because defense, while it doesn't take as much game planning as playing receiver, um, and I'm talking about playing cornerback here, um you you still need to spend some time in those rooms to some degree, right? You know what I'm saying? You can't just go out there on a whim and just cover Devontae Adams, who, you know, isn't the Devontae Adams we once knew, but still pretty decent. You can't just go out there on a whim and just cover Devontae Adams after spending very little time in the film room, right? Um, but what was impressive about what he did, the guy went out there, Travis Hunter got his first 100-plus yard gain, got his first touchdown. You know, I know a lot of people will say like um the game had gotten out of hand, this, that, and the other. But still, that's good for his psyche, too. Although he said himself, right, Phil, he's not worried about stats. He's worried about winning, which sounds like a number one receiver to me, right? Sounds like a franchise player to me. Sounds like somebody who deservedly um has earned the title of somebody you would want to give up the picks that we gave up for. That's a true leader, right? That's somebody who um will have that C patch on his jersey one day, right? He's obviously not a me guy. But what was impressive about it too is on the flip side. Which I was just kind of talking about, which is is kind of hard to do. But I would assume he spent some time in the defensive room this week, just not a lot. But on the flip side, he went out there and had a pass deflection against Devontae Adams on a well-played play where, you know, he he played it well against a veteran. And you know, we're starting to see the performance he had on offensive side. We're starting to see this consistently, where you know, even despite if he's having a little amount of time in the defensive room, in the cornerback's room, we're seeing a player who is very good at mirroring some of the better players in the league, right? You know what I'm saying? Like, and we're seeing it on a consistent base. And I think like that's kind of why we want to see him more feel on defense, because we've seen, aside from that Jamar Chase, or I think it was Higgins played where they flagged him. Like, he really hasn't looked overwhelmed, and that wasn't even his fault, right? Like, he was there, he played it well, in my opinion, and that the refs just got him. You know, the refs get everybody upset the Kansas City Chiefs. But I mean, well, apparently they got the Chiefs too when we played them too as well. Let Chiefs fans tell it. Uh, you know, it shouldn't have been a flag on the BTJ pass interference, according to them. But um, yeah, man, very impressed with that young man. Um, now what I will say, what this opens the door for if they can, man, like now it opens the door, and it's kind of a shame that it has to be this way, but they drafted him for this reason. This opens the door, the performance he had opens the door for him to play. You know, last week I was saying he should be on the field 90% of the defensive reps. Well, what he just did on offense and with the strokes of BTJ, this opens the door to say he should be on the field like 80% of the offensive snaps, too. Like now we're opening this door where it feels like Travis Hunter needs to be on the field on both sides of the ball, which is crazy, 80% to 90% of the time on both sides of the ball. And I do think that's a huge ax for a rookie. I do, don't get me wrong. But he's shown us that it's a it's a possibility that he can handle it. And if we don't at least see, like we're not doing ourselves any due diligence, you know, if if we don't at least see, which again, I know it's hard to do because you're limiting how much time he can spend in the other room when he's spending time in one room, but you gotta at least try and see how it goes, in my opinion.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, if um yeah, there's not really too much else to discuss here as far as this game, Jay. I mean, penalties continuing to be a thing. Defense did what they could for, I guess, a little bit. Matthew Stafford is an elite quarterback. Uh, there's you know, a lot of stuff that we already know. Um, so you know, if you if you uh I I know there are maybe a couple other things you want to mention, but like I do just want to talk about really quick like who are going to be those teams that they have to compete with for this wildcard spot. So I'll let you say, I know you have a little bit more to add on about this game. Let's do that. Let's go, let's go back to you first before we talk about the teams because it's gonna be a very heavy, there's gonna be a lot of competition to get into this wildcard spot. So, yeah, I'll let you talk about what else you want to discuss when it comes to this game, and then we'll just talk about that and then the bye week.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, uh well, one of the other things uh I want to discuss is, and this doesn't help Trevor right at all either. But Liam's not running the ball as much as they should be. And Trevor's never gonna be this quarterback, kind of making my point even more than I was talking about earlier, where he doesn't have to be an elite quarterback. Well, he's never gonna be an elite quarterback to the point where you could throw the ball as much as we did and have success anyway. Like you, he's gonna have to have some kind of which you you said it, you said Saquon was a prime example, right? Um, he's gonna have to have some kind of a run game to help him. And the thing is, what's puzzling to me that don't follow on Trevor is they actually do have a run game that they can lean on a little bit more. Um, in Trav ZTN, about two weeks ago, Travis Etien was top four in rushing, right? Now he's around top eight, I think. We'll have to see what the statistics look like after this week and what the other running backs do, but he's still like top eight. Uh, he's a guy you have to get the ball more. Just like we've been having this conversation about giving Travis Hunter the ball more. We need to have that trap, that conversation about the other Travis that wears number one. He needs to be getting the ball a lot more. And Bascial Tootin, who, you know, Bascial Tootin, up until what, two, three weeks ago, he never registered a negative play behind the line of scrimmage, Phil. How are we not utilizing that, right? Um, he at least has broke even, you know, up until two weeks ago, he was at least breaking even to the line of scrimmage or getting positive yards. LaQuent Allen is talented as well. You invested two picks into the running back room, and they're not getting the usage that they should be getting, right? And you felt so comfortable enough with what you have there that you traded Tank Bigsby. And here we are having the conversation about them not being utilized enough. Again, Liam has more coaching ability than I could ever have in my whole body, but still nonetheless, you know, especially that third quarter, especially, Phil. This is what I was talking about with you. I felt like even when we were down 21 to nothing, I still found myself questioning, like, why aren't we running the ball a little bit more? The game is not that out of reach to the point where we just gotta abandon the run completely. And also, too, what you do when you get into that kind of pattern of throwing as much as they were. Okay, let's say, let's let's say that hypothetically, Trevor Lawrence and offense were able to score on those drives. Seven points, three points, whatever the case may be. We'll even say seven for the sake of this conversation. Well, what that does is you're putting your defense back on the field by passing so much back on the field quickly, and they're not gonna last to the fourth quarter, right? You have to have some sort of a run game to balance out these things. And had the Jacksonville Jaguars been able to score, all they would have been doing is getting their defense back on the field rather quickly. And we would have saw where they probably would have burnt down in the fourth quarter, which they didn't have a great fourth quarter anyway, but they would have looked much worse. So that's something that Liam has to find the balance of. That's why we brought him in. Like when we have these conversations about, or when we had the conversations about Liam, the one thing that kept coming up was like, oh, did you see what he did with Bucky Irving? Did you see what he did with the other running back? We're not having those conversations with Liam right now. So that's one of my other takeaways is I would like to see us run the ball more. Um, and then lastly, uh Trayvon Walker's check is getting only bigger because we're seeing that without him, that this defense doesn't look great. And I don't want to say without him because he's seeing the field limited snaps, and maybe the bye week, you know, after the bye week and some a good amount of rest, we can get him on the field more like he was getting on the field before he was injured. Maybe we'll see. But he's seeing the field for limited snaps, and you know, it maybe because he's not he he he can't be as effective as he was with the with the cast on or whatever the case may be. But we've seen when healthy, 100% healthy or close to 100% and not, you know, fresh off of surgery, how much different this defense looks when Trayvon Walker's out there, right? Josh Allen looks significantly different, right? And so on and so forth. So, you know, I think Trayvon Walker's check is written itself in terms of him needing to be paid alongside Devin Lloyd as well. I forgot we were without Devin Lloyd too. Um it was so bad of a game, I forgot he went there, Phil, the defensive player of the year, right?
SPEAKER_02:Devin Lloyd, Trayvon Walker, they're they're about to make some money. Caleb on Jason is making is making plays for New England. Like, man, Tyson Campbell had a pick six today. Like, I mean, it wasn't necessarily like a coverage pick six, the ball was dropped, and then he, you know, he snagged it out of the air, which is good for him, but still it's like, you know, uh it's a bad optics are bad because you know, Greg Newsom's hasn't done that since hey man go ahead.
SPEAKER_00:Hey, the the human in me, yeah, the optics are bad, and you know, from that perspective, it's like uh you hate to see Tyson having the success he's having, or the success he had for that play in particular, but at the same time, it's like in it to some degree you gotta root for the guy. Like, he got traded to Cleveland, man. Like, how can you not feel bad for somebody that got traded to Cleveland, bro? Like, so I'm I'm happy for the man. Go Tyson, go Downs, man.
SPEAKER_02:And an offense intended, Cleveland. I don't I don't want uh I want it to be clear that we do mean to offend. So um yeah, let's uh like I said, I I kind of want to just move on from this thing and and not watch them for a week. So at least we're we have a little bit of a break from the team. So um so here is what the playoff picture is is going to look like as we head into our buy. Uh, first off, you know, the Patriots were obviously on a heater. They have been they are that team this year that they're they're kind of like the Washington commanders of this year, right? So they're a current they're currently five and two, and you know what that means, Jay, is that the Buffalo Bills are in second. So one of those two teams is gonna be is gonna take a wild card spot, which only leaves what two more. So we have Pittsburgh and Cincinnati, and then people are not going to count out Baltimore. I'm not willing to do that yet, even though their defense is terrible. So when it comes to the AFC North, like are you looking at maybe Pittsburgh, Cincy, and Baltimore? Like, do one of those teams take it? I don't even I don't even think you can say that because the AFC West is crazy. Because of course you have Denver who pulled off a big win today. Then you have the Chargers, who obviously got off to a great start, but now you know there's kind of similar ship that Jacksonville is with their injuries, especially offensive line. Theirs are worse. At least our guys are coming back, like those offensive guys, linemen guys. Like, I don't know when they're gonna be back. And then you have the the Chiefs, man. Like the Chiefs are never gonna go away. So you're talking about two spots, and you know, we do have the easier part of the schedule coming up, but not if they're playing like this. Like, we know we've been you know we know in watching this team, they can lose to anybody. It doesn't matter what the record is, it doesn't matter who lines up against, it doesn't matter who the quarterback is, they can make that team look really good. And uh I think what has complicated this is that the AFC East at the top is better than we thought it was going to be. I thought I think a lot of people thought maybe New England was a year away, but not with Mike Vrabel, man. What they're doing up there doesn't surprise me. So yeah, we're talking about two spots, and then you know, one of them probably goes to Kansas City or Denver or L like or LA. Like, man, there's just a lot it's a lot more competitive in in the conference than I think maybe some people anticipated. So how are you feeling about this? Because you did make the comment, like, yeah, we're still in it, four and three for sure. Um, but um and they just have two games against Indy coming up, which are gonna be huge as well on the in the second half.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, not not just Indy though. That makes the the game because you just mentioned this team against Denver that much important. That could be the difference, right? When in that game in Denver, which I had as a loss, by the way, because they had to go to Denver, but it makes it that much more important. Um now it is games against the Titans, too. Yeah, two against the Titans, so right, right, which and that's that's kind of the key here is for as bad as we looked, and yeah, you're right, like we can lose to any given team on any given Sunday, right? Um, so there is that. But for as bad as we've looked, a lot of the teams that are left on the schedule look worse, you know, like they look like they'll be picking in the top 10 of the draft. For example, like we played the Titans twice.
SPEAKER_02:Let me bring this up really quick, Jay. Sorry to cut you off. So this is remaining strength of schedule. I have that pulled up here in Tankathon. Shout out to them. We have the 30th ranked strength of schedule, meaning that's good. So, like, as far as strength of schedule remaining. Um the only team with worse strength schedule is New England's remaining schedule, it is crazy. I saw that they have the easiest remaining schedule. They played the Jets twice, they got the Dolphins, they got the Browns, the Giants. They have a crazy schedule.
SPEAKER_00:I saw that. I saw a graphic. Somebody put like one of the um the bar graphs on there.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Oh my god.
SPEAKER_02:So they're our 30th. Which is good. So um, and then up there towards the top is um I think I where did I see? I think it's Kansas. Kansas City is tour is up there, I believe. Um it's a lot of NFC teams that have really difficult schedules left over. So yeah, I just wanted to point that out. I had I I pulled that up here.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. I mean, no, that that kind of makes the point more for me. Good job on pulling that out. I didn't even know Tankadon did strengthen. Yeah, actually, because they have to calculate draft rankings. So, yeah, okay, yeah. They do strength the schedule. Um, but anyway, but yeah, I mean, you look at these teams, man. Like, um, we're looking at teams who again, like, we've looked pretty bad these two games. Don't get me wrong. Um, but we're looking at teams that have looked worse. Like, again, playing the Titans twice, bro. I saw the Titans, I watched the Titans game, what was it, a week or two ago, man, against Arizona. I saw the Titans. They when you want to talk about luck and until your first win, it was luck. Um, I saw Cam Ward throw a pick. The person who picked it off wasn't touched, and when he hit the ground, he fumbled it, it rolled into the end zone. And then um the receiver, I forget his name, he came from Seattle, jumped on it. When you talk about luck and like just these and these crazy things having to happen for them to win, that's literally the definition of it. So, you know, it's a good thing that we play a team like that twice. We play a Cardinals team who, you know, I thought heading into that game, um, I'd be a little bit more concerned with them. And they were one of those those teams who I thought would show improvement, but it it hasn't been there as well. I literally just talked about them losing to the Titans, right? So that shows you what they could be every day. Um again, another game that I actually, you know, when you look at the the last part of this schedule that I was given a little bit more respect towards, um, that don't look that threatening anymore, the Chargers. Right? We just saw them lose to the Colts and you know, by a pretty good margin, too. The again, the only one that really, of course, is the Colts that concern you and the Denver game, but you look at these other opponents, the Jets, right? Who we have a conversation now or thread about them every week, right? In terms of um now, and you know, they said it on the East Coast um Rams podcast, which I agree with. I think Aaron Glenn's a good coach, which we mentioned on there. It's just that, you know, he inherited a mess, right? And it could get worse if they start training away players that we've been talking about in the trade deadline. But um when you look at the last games, you look at the ones that you would certainly say Vegas was um favorite us in right field, it's the Raiders. Um I could say for sure the Raiders is the Titans twice. So that's three games. The Jets, that's four, that's eight wins right there. If we can win the ones that Vegas project us to win, and then you just you know, to get to ten wins, what I say that was eight, you gotta um either beat the Colts once, and you gotta add in the Chargers in there as well, which like none of these are impossible to win, or you could beat the Texans as well, too, which you know that can go either way as well. So that's one to circle too. So yeah, I mean, I still like our chances, despite how um how it's getting in terms of how close that wild card race will be. And also just keep in mind this too, like the Colts do, and this is this is a history thing. Remember, we had this conversation, Phil. Sometimes you just gotta ask yourself, what does history say? The Colts have that game where they have to come to Jacksonville, right? And history just don't, you know, bowl well, regardless of, you know, it's been times where the Colts have had a significantly better team than us and come into Jacksonville, and they just still couldn't get it done. It's just something about that where um, you know, it's just when they get off the bus, it's like they realize they're in Jacksonville and it's impossible to win here. But yeah, I don't we'll see. Time will tell on that. Um, but yeah, having the 30th ranked strength of schedule um with a wildcard race so tight puts the Jaguars in a position. Basically, everything you just said, Phil, they control their own destiny, which a lot of teams can't say, you know, in terms of when you factor in what their strength of schedule is, some people can't really determine their destiny because their strength of schedule is a lot higher than what we're dealing with.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so you know that is something to you know, hang your hat on. Like we, I would have to go back and listen to our episode as far as where we thought they would be heading out of the bye. I think probably three and four. If we if we probably went back into it, it was probably three and four, I assume, losses to Cincy, San Francisco, Kansas City, and then probably the Rams or the Seahawks. Probably, you know, one of those was probably a loss. Three and four, two and five. I probably had them more at two and five because I had them coming out of a you know, going into a really slow start. So um, yeah, like I said, you certainly want to change the culture here and and the way you you think about Jaguar football and like saying, hey, we're four and three, like you know, that is certainly part of it, and and trying to adjust the way that this fan base and the front office want to look at this team, but like that is you will take that. We're year one in the Liam Cohen. Quarterback is a whole nother thing. We'll approach that, you know. Obviously, in the offseason, can't do anything about it right now. Um, you know, I don't I definitely don't think they should go trade, bring Mac Jones back or anything like that. I don't I don't think any trade like that is gonna happen. I don't see a quarterback coming in and there being some sort of competition. That's not gonna happen.
SPEAKER_00:Also, Phil, with the Mac Jones um argument, too. I thought about this today, Phil. Everybody that wants to scream for Mac Jones, well, keep this in mind too. Brian Thomas Jr. isn't the Brian Thomas Jr. he was that put on the heat uh that that put up the performance that he put up when Mac Jones was killing it or having moderate success last year as well. Keep in mind that you bring Mac Jones into the situation, he's doing he's dealing with a new Brian Thomas Jr. that drops a lot of passes. So even he, you know, if you want to make that argument, even he wouldn't look that great because his the guy that he looked to the most as his number one receiver isn't who he once was.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, exactly. So yeah, really, really good point. But um, yeah, Jay, you know, a lot to work on heading into the bye. You know, I'm sure the coaches are frustrated. I didn't see a post-game speech come up on social media quite yet. So who knows if that's going to uh continue as far as the social media access, but we'll see. I think we're gonna we're gonna have some news to talk about here in the next week. I don't think that we're gonna be able to take the week off for the bye because I do think they are going to make a move. Uh and they've been moving money around, obviously they've been very aggressive. And what whatever that's gonna be, uh wide receiver, interior lineman signing a kicker off the street, combination of all those things. So we will see what happens. Jay, anything else you want to mention before we wrap up this week's episode and head into the bye week? Uh is there maybe a uh a guy you'd like to see them target offensively or defensively, like that's at the top of your list? Like if you were to script it up the way that you wanted and it, you know, you it worked out the way exactly how you would approach it as far as targeting a guy. Are there is there are there one or two guys on that list that you'd like to see them bring in?
SPEAKER_00:It's kind of hard to say because we we're in a situation where um you know we we need our draft picks and everything that I feel like we could do with more future. So um, like, you know, I I want Quentin Williams, right? But how how do you get Quentin Williams here without giving up another first? You know what I'm saying? So that's where the it becomes hard. Now, I I you know I can maybe envision a situation. Maybe you can get a Chris Olave without giving up a first, you know, that'll you'll take that any day of the week. Maybe, maybe we'll see. I don't know. Um, I know Mickey Loomis is not a good GM in New Orleans. I know that. So maybe, you know, you could do the Trent Balkey special on him, you know, and get Olave for uh less than a first. We'll see. Um, but yeah, those are the two like that I really like. But um to get them, yeah, it you probably especially Williams, you have to mortgage the future. So we'll see in time, we'll tell, man. Um, but yeah, I'll I'll put some more thought into it and we'll circle back around to it on the next week.
SPEAKER_02:So yeah, sounds good. But uh Jaguar fans, hey, enjoy your week off, man. Uh, do do something with the family. Go uh have a nice brunch. Uh enjoy your football Sunday next week, and uh do you know, do do something for yourself, for your mental health. You know, it's it's it's hard keeping up with this team. So uh we appreciate all of you for checking out episode 127 of the Touchdown Jaguars podcast. Once again, make sure you click the Link Tree link in the show notes of this and every single episode uh to keep up with everything related to the team. Uh follow Jay and I on our personal pages as well. And make sure to keep using that promo code Touchdown Jaguars. Save yourself some money on your first purchase with SeatGeek. But folks, that is my co-host James Johnson. I am Phil Barrera, and do not forget to tune in the Touchdown Jaguars for each and every Jaguar touchdown. And we will see you next week, Duval.
